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RE: use case



Hello Steinar,

 

As you correctly state the use of 1588 transparent (or boundary) clocks  would allow, at least in principle, a lower priority to be set for a 1588 stream, between that of RoE and “other” traffic. However transparent clock functionality is by no means universal and is still considered by some as controversial. It therefore may be the case that it might be necessary to use the same priority as RoE packets. Deterministic insertion of PTP is in principle possible (at least in some scenarios where the PTP devices are aware of, or are the source of the RoE stream) but would constrain the synchronisation topologies possible.

 

Although the required bandwidth for an individual 1588 stream is small compared to the RoE  flow it is associated with, and the 1588 packets themselves are relatively small, there will be multiple 1588 streams, 1 per 1588 master  / slave pair and their impact on packet jitter of the RoE stream (or conversely that of the RoE on PTP performance)  and “other” traffic blocking behaviour may perhaps become significant in some deployment scenarios.

 

Of course all of this pre-supposes the use of 1588 as at least part of the synchronisation solution. Some of the issues could be addressed by specifying adopting a particular 1588 profile mandating 1588 encapsulation, message rates, use of on path support (Boundary or Transparent clocks), etc.. but perhaps that is then staying too far from the intent of this group?

 

Regards

 

Peter

 

 

From: Steinar Bjørnstad [mailto:Steinar.Bjornstad@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: 26 February 2015 11:59
To: Peter Turnbull
Cc: Jouni Korhonen; Lars Ellegaard; STDS-1904-3-TF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: use case

 

Hello,

As I know 1588 it is a packet-stream with a much lower packet-rate than a ROE stream. If 1588 is tunneled transparently through the network, it will be very sensitive to packet-jitter and must receive highest priority. In the case of a CBR ROE It should however be possible to deterministically insert 1588 packets in between the ROE packets which will be generated in a deterministic way. In the case of transparent clock processing of 1588 packets at intermediate nodes packet-jitter is tolerated and the packets will not need the same priority as ROE packets. This may be required in the case of VBR ROE streams?

 

I.e. I am not sure if I understand how e.g. 1588 should impact packet jitter and packet/frame size. Perhaps you can help me out with a concrete example?

 

Best regards

 

Steinar

 

 

26. feb. 2015 kl. 12:25 skrev Peter Turnbull <pturnbull@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>:



Hello All,

 

I wonder if it is safe to be agnostic on the synchronisation mechanisms and assume that it will be provided by A N Other. While reuse of existing tools (e.g. IEEE1588, SyncE) will be preferred to reinventing the wheel, which tools are used and how they are deployed may impact other decisions. For example calculations on Packet jitter vs packet/frame size should include the impact of 1588 (as a second high priority stream alongside the RoE user plane data).

 

Regards

 

Peter

 

Peter Turnbull
Principal Engineer
ADVA Optical Networking
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From: stds-1904-3-tf@xxxxxxxx [mailto:stds-1904-3-tf@xxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jouni Korhonen
Sent: 25 February 2015 20:04
To: Lars Ellegaard; STDS-1904-3-TF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: use case

 

Hi,

 

Thanks for the input. See my initial comments inline.

 

From: Lars Ellegaard [mailto:le@xxxxxxxxxxx] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 8:38 AM
To: Jouni Korhonen; 
STDS-1904-3-TF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: use case

 

All,

 

The use cases that came out of last meeting show various example deployments and starts to nail down the RoE-functionality.

I find it equally important to explicitly state the assumptions made on the underlying Ethernet network.

No good to design an RoE-function that doesn’t have a network to support it (and vice versa).

 

Examples:

•             What are the networking tools supposed to be used (such as 1588, SyncE, “not” GNSS, 802.1Q or TSN?, etc.)

[Jouni Korhonen]

We’ll assume we got time, sync and a working clock distribution in place. We are not going to state which one. We can at most give a guidance which tools are desirable. The same goes for the rest as well. .1Q is a safe assumption but not all deployments have to rely on its presence.

 

•             What are the parametric requirements of the network (we can start out with qualitative statements)

[Jouni Korhonen]

Give an example what parametric requirements you are after.

 

•             The use case ppt shows one switch here and there – is that the limit? How flexible does the network have to be? What is the delay limit and how is/can this be budgeted?

[Jouni Korhonen]

We do not state a limit for the number of switches.. that will vary & evolve anyway. The delay budget depends on what has been allocated for the front-haul in general (e.g. in CPRI case ~100us one way). How you divide that between nodes on the path is not imho for us to define.  

 

•             Is this a peering or overlay arrangement ? I mean, do we foresee that RoE frames are somehow processed (e.g. monitored) on the path, or is the path completely transparent? The answer to this may impact the type/size of time stamp used.

[Jouni Korhonen]

Good question. I do not have an answer right now.

 

- Jouni

 

Thanks,

Lars

 

(Lars Ellegaard, Princ. Eng,

Vitesse Semiconductor)

 

-----Original Message-----
From: 
stds-1904-3-tf@xxxxxxxx [mailto:stds-1904-3-tf@xxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jouni Korhonen
Sent: 17 February 2015 18:05
To: 
STDS-1904-3-TF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: call#1 minutes

 

Quick minutes and the slides I used attached. Note that I added one more slide to list all function combination without any network drawn into the picture.

 

 

Start:

                ~8AM PST - ~8:46AM PST

 

Present (sorry if I missed someone or mistyped the name):

                Pedro Batista

                Jouni Korhonen

                Bomin Li

                Peter Turnbull

                Philippe Sherier

                Steinar Bjoernstad

                Zakaria Tayq

                Kevin Bross

                Peter Ashwood-Smith

                Satory Matsushima

 

Discussion:

                The call concentrated on agreeing the baseline and assumptions for

                the CPRI mapper and RoE encapsulation/decapsulation functions

                and their placement in the system.        

 

                The attached powerpoint concludes the combinations for functions.

                It should be noted that the mapper also contains the RoE encap/decap

                function. However, the RoE encap/decap can be deployed as standalone

                function (assume that RE and/or REC are the "native" RoE compliant

                devices).

 

                The mapper & encap/decap functions can be part of the switch,

                RE, REC or be standalone frontends or "sidecards".

 

                We aim to define 1:1 translation between CPRI frame format and

                native RoE encapsulation.

 

                CPRI rates 1 to 7 are of interest (because the use 8B/10B line

                coding).

               

Next steps:

 

                * Look into the RoE header itself.

                * Agree on the basics for the AxC to RoE flow mapping e.g. only

                   one AxC per Ethernet packet etc.

                * Agree RoE encapsulated packet properties e.g. whether the

                   payload always has static size (after the flow/link has been

                   established) etc.

                * Study how CPRI rates affect RoE encapsulated packet sizes..

 

 

                Contributions are welcome.. I'll send out the next agenda next week.

 

--

Jouni Korhonen, Ph.D, Associate Technical Director CTO Office, Networking, Broadcom Corporation

O: +1-408-922-8135,  M: +1-408-391-7160